Refined Black Beauty

[InsideInfo]

Just came yesterday! I do love the headstock on these later models. I don't know much about the ghost saddles that were installed but I would like to know why it is causing quite. But of noise just being plugged in and on a distortion preset. I never noticed it but while plugged in and on a distorted preset my other refined fly makes a bit of noise tho less than this one. And the pre refine makes zero noise. I'm sure you know VJ I'm not sure why you'd want these saddles if there is no midi hookup?

[mmmguitar]

This makes #5, then? Let us know which of the three generations of piezo tones you prefer.

In the last few years of Fly production, Parker left Fishman entirely due to Graphtech having an “all-in-one” modular solution that eliminated the labor and parts overhead of putting Roland electronics in the MIDI Flys (Your Fly requires only an extra board and hole for the 13 pin-out to be a MIDI Fly). I have a Ghost Hex system in one of my Flys, and frankly prefer its implementation to the cluttered look of the Roland system (performance differences notwithstanding).

Concerning the noise, is it a grounding issue where it goes away once you touch the strings or switches? If so, some extra grounding under the hood may be all that’s necessary. I do agree about the refined Fly circuitry being generally noisier than the pre-refined, though - I always assumed it was just due to the ribbon assembly being fabricated and tested to much higher spec and tighter tolerances than the remarkably cheap components I’ve found USM and JAM used. But maybe someone in the know could shed further light on this.

That all being said, how does this one feel and sound compared to the others? These and the pickup ring-equipped Flys from the era have always intrigued me.

[vjmanzo]

Congrats, @InsideInfo! You’re definitely building a swarm of Flys now!!

@mmmguitar is right: adding MIDI functionality is super-easy with the Graphtech. I’ve never encountered the issue you’re describing but I think Marc’s assessment and suggestions are spot on.

I too am intrigued by the very late model Flys; super-thin neck, right?

[jb63]

Way back along time ago, on the old forum, I posted some assessments with not actual values about the 4 different saddle/preamp choices.
The Graphtech are the noisiest, which really comes through if you use a lot of processing. Try going EVH-style straight into your amp and get the leanest, cleanest sound from your piezos only. It should have a very bright, clean sound with no distortion. Then slowly go from low to big gain on the guitar while keeping the amp gain low and find the place where the distortion starts and the fuzz happens. If this all plays out in the usual way, you've just tested everything and you now know your piezo's limitations. If you get anything weird like buzz or hum you aren't expecting, you probably have an easy-to fix problem, sometimes a bad graph tech preamp, which is cheap and an easy user-fix.

Try that with each of your guitars with different piezo/preamp combos and you'll see why graph tech is the noisiest and the original fisherman with the ribbon and the board is the cleanest!

Graphtech has a mid/dark boost switch that can be installed as a push-pull or push-push (in the bush) switch that I've put into 2 guitars. I really use it a lot when driving piezo-only solos with this system. Its also an easy user-install.

I'm currently saving up some time and money to re-fit stuff with the RMC saddles and preamps which have become my favorites, even though they require a subsonic filter if I'm using them in 13-pin devices. But their clean piezo sound is the best for me, when I can't have the original fishman 1990s system.

I generally watch for beaters just to try to find good internal wiring and original saddles to salvage for this, but they are few and far between.

Play more, buy less, that's my 2021 mantra!

Good hunting!

[mmmguitar]

I'm currently saving up some time and money to re-fit stuff with the RMC saddles and preamps which have become my favorites, even though they require a subsonic filter if I'm using them in 13-pin devices.

I’m very much out of the loop with RMC since 2011 or so: Wasn’t part of the appeal of using Richard’s PolyDrive preamp due to it already having the subsonic filter in it? I may be confusing the internal board with the stompbox version. I remember reading that I’d need to install the filter in my GR55 in order for the Ghost system to work “optimally” with it; but was never deep-enough into it to notice any degradation in performance between it and my Roland-outfitted guitars sufficient to throw money at the filter mod.

I am very interested in being sold on going with RMC rather than Ghost in my future Fly retrofits. To be honest, JAM abandoning Fishman for Graphtech had pushed RMC out of my mind.

[vjmanzo]

The RMC Polydrive II piezo sounds great; to my ears, it’s possibly the cleanest and clearest piezo preamp of all four used on Flys (both Fishman preamps, the Graphtech, and the RMC, which, I believe, was only used on the Belewberry DF842—I’d have to consult the catalogs), but I have heard from a few guitar techs and @VinceGenella that those piezo elements in the gold saddles are not built to last, and commonly fail in under a decade.

YMWV, but it’s something I do think about; I’ve never had an issue with the Fishman piezo elements in my Flys that I haven’t been able to troubleshoot, and I’ve only hear of a handful of scenarios where they outright failed.